The Steep Stuff Podcast
Welcome to the Steep Stuff Podcast, your source for all things Short Trail
The Steep Stuff Podcast
#142 - Robin Vieira Brower
The view from a razorback ridge can change your life—and your training. We invited Robin Vieira Brower, one of the few American women racing the Skyrunner World Series, to unpack how she built a season across Austria and Ireland, what “sea to sky” truly demands, and why skyrunning needs a bigger footprint in the U.S. Robin shares a refreshingly candid path from college soccer to technical mountain running, the exact workouts that paid off on steep grades, and the mindset shift required when weather cancels races the day before the start.
We dig into the nuts and bolts—heart rate based training, base-building through winter, and the intervals that translate directly to efficient climbing and controlled descending. Robin also opens up about running a creative studio while racing internationally, turning storytelling into a strength instead of a distraction. We compare skyrunning with Golden Trail and UTMB, talk through ISF standards that protect the sport’s identity, and spotlight the best U.S. gateways for “real sky” skills: Cirque Series venues, The Rut, Alyeska, and the Wasatch. Expect practical insights on gear, travel, and course selection, plus honest talk about representation and how to support more women on technical terrain.
If you’ve wondered how to break into skyrunning—or just want to understand why switchbacks are sometimes optional in Europe—this conversation delivers a clear map and plenty of motivation. Tap play, then tell us which course you’d race first. If you’re enjoying the show, follow Robin at @mindfullyrobin, subscribe, and leave a quick review to help more mountain athletes find us.
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Welcome back to this Deep Stuff Podcast. I'm your host, James L'Oriello. And today I'm so excited to bring you guys an episode with Robin Vieira Brower, the Pacific Northwest Native, was kind enough to come on the pod and talk all things skyrunning. Robin is one of the few Americans and definitely one of the few American women right now competing on the World Skyrunning series. And she was kind enough to come on and give us her time and talk all things skyrunning. We got into it all. We talked about her season where she just wrapped up her season with a top 10 finish at the Mourne Skyline Skyrace in Ireland. She also raced over in Austria as well and just kind of had a stack season and threw down at some uh at a Cirque Series race uh as well at Cirque Series Crystal. Um we talked all about skyrunning, how it can get in the United States, uh what it needs to get more awareness in the US, talking about the courses, the types of courses, um, the vertical relief. Uh we talked about the ISF, the World Skyrunning Series, um, what it's like as an American going over there to race and just racing abroad for her first season. So that was a bunch of fun. Um, really want to thank her for coming on, and uh hope you guys enjoy this one. I'm a big fan of Robin's, and uh yeah, I'm very excited for where her future is gonna take her in the sport. Interesting human. Uh, she's also a creative, and you guys will see that come through when you follow her on social media. Um, very, very talented on the creative side as well, and that comes through for her storytelling ability as an athlete. So without further ado, I hope you guys enjoyed the spawn. Robin Viera Brouwer. Ladies and gentlemen, sweet sweet. Robin Viera Brower, welcome to the Steep Stuff Podcast. How's it going?
SPEAKER_00:Going well, yeah. Thanks for having me.
SPEAKER_02:Yeah, stoked to finally have a conversation. I feel like this is I I feel like it's uh it's been hard to put this one together, so I'm glad we were finally able to do it. I feel like you're you're like the only American woman in Skyrunning right now, and we were definitely due to have a conversation. So happy to happy to do this one.
SPEAKER_00:Yeah, happy to be here and and dig into all the things. There's there's a lot to talk about, and I'm um excited to see the sport grow globally, but for sure in North America.
SPEAKER_02:Oh, yeah, definitely. We'll get it, we'll definitely get into it. Before we get started though, I I'd love to hear more on your background. Like, what's the give me like the five-minute elevator pitch on where you grew up, how you got into sport, and kind of your relationship with sport.
SPEAKER_00:Yeah, let's see. Five minute elevator pitch. So I I will say, I'll start by saying I have a very, I guess, non-traditional uh entrance into the running world. Um, but but I do my background, like many others, I played team sports. I grew up playing soccer, um, played soccer in college at University of Peach Sound, and had a lot of success with soccer my whole life. That was was my whole life. Um and fell in love with sport at an early age. At the same time, I grew up in Seattle. So my parents introduced me to the outdoors pretty early on. So I skied and um yeah, grew up skiing and grew up pretty close to the mountains, but not quite in the mountains. I was, I guess, a city girl, um, but didn't realize it at the time. And so um my relationship with running, particularly trail running in the mountains, didn't really come to fruition until after I graduated from college and stopped playing soccer. I actually hated running up until um the point where I didn't really have anywhere else to turn and um fell in love with trail running uh as a means to just be outside and closer to nature. And I remember seeing people, you know, on trails with their super heavy like hiking gear. And it seemed nice to be really close to the mountains, but I was always looking for a more efficient way to be in them and to get up high. And um once I learned, you know, that you can do that with certain types of trail running, I fell in love with it and um started competing in some local races and was podiuming and you know, had a realization that I might have something here, but I I knew that I was really strong and interested in the technical side of trail running and I didn't quite know, I didn't know about skyrunning, I didn't know what that would look like yet. So I kind of I turned to um, you know, people that I had heard about, like Emily Forsberg, and was kind of enchanted by that way of accessing steep terrain in the mountains. And so eventually um it took a while to get there, but I I found skyrunning and uh a couple years ago decided that that was what I wanted to pursue next. I I took some time off running for a variety of reasons and came back like headfirst dove into skyrunning, um, met my coach and have been training like solely focused on skyrunning for the past couple years ever since. So it's been a journey to get here and um like a pretty unconventional one, I think. So uh I'm very grateful for all the exposure and opportunities that have come my way.
SPEAKER_02:So cool. Now I and I love your background, they especially the non-traditional aspect of it. I come from a soccer background myself, so I always I've got a yeah, I definitely always feel for the folks that didn't come from like track and field or were steeplers. And what what position did you play uh in soccer?
SPEAKER_00:I played forward, like well, I played forward and center mid, but forward was kind of my my my sweet spot.
SPEAKER_02:Um I'm not sorry, I still haven't had a defender on the podcast, and I'm like kind of upset. Really? Yeah, yeah.
SPEAKER_00:I think I you know, I always admired defenders because they were I I've always been on the small side, and so that was my like challenge with soccer. Um, so I I kind of envied the defenders because they were always able to like muscle their way through things, but I was always the speedy one, like, you know, doing the long runs and sprints and whatnot. But that was growing up one of my biggest challenges with soccer, and I ran into it all the time. And I had tons of coaches um tell me that I wasn't gonna go anywhere with soccer unless I like put some mass on. So I spent a lot of time in the gym at an early age trying to develop that. And that's also like when I finally found trail running, I felt so at home in my like body and and capabilities there. So yeah.
SPEAKER_02:Interesting. You see, like I always had the issue was for me, I had the speed, and I feel like a lot of athletes do it's the skill. And I never like wanted to, especially like like young in high school and and below that, like I just never wanted to take the time to like put emphasis on like learn more of the ball handling skills and stuff like that. It was more so let me just use my speed to compensate for all those shortcomings. And yeah, that's why I didn't have much of a career in soccer out like in college. But yeah, it was it was a it's a fun sport though. Team sports are different, it's interesting like that dichotomy and crossover, um, you know, coming from a team sport than going to more of a solo sport and trail running where it's kind of all about us, but at the same time, we also try to make it about community. So it's kind of weird, right?
SPEAKER_00:Yeah, it is. It's it it is weird. And I I'm still I think because I have such a, you know, that team sport background, I'm still trying to figure out how to how how to have come from that and go into this because there is the the the backbone of of trail running, no matter what type of trail running is community, right? Like we wouldn't be here without that side of things. So um it's an interesting crossover for sure.
SPEAKER_02:Yeah. All right. So let's dive headfirst into skyrunning. I gotta ask you, like, what was there any like one thing that stood out to you, like where you saw, I don't know, maybe KJ or Emily, somebody running on this ridge, and they were like, that was inspiring. Like, what was like how did you exactly find it? I think that's that's more of the story, just because it's it's such a niche thing, especially in the in in the United States.
SPEAKER_00:Yeah, totally. I don't know if there was a particular like moment where that that stands out in my mind, but I I know that I I'm I'm I could be such a romantic when it comes to just, I don't know, my relationship with being in the mountains, just the feeling of being up up high and out there. And so I think I I probably saw or read something from Emily and felt, you know, like her connection with the mountains is probably what the root of all of it stemmed from. And I I fell in love with the ability to be that connected to the mountains, um, and therefore learned, oh, she, you know, I mean, she has a lot of other things aside from skyrunning, but she like that skyrunning. So I I made this connection early on that that ability to be far in and high up in the mountains, um just created this like level of connection to them that was just very enticing to me. That coupled with the endurance side, obviously, that's necessary to do skyrunning races and run that type of terrain. Um, I was like, oh, it hit me. I was like, okay, this, I don't know how, I don't know when. I don't even really know why yet, but at some point I need to like, I need to pursue this and figure out that side of things. But it's funny because at that time in my life, I was pretty far away from getting close to that. So it felt pretty unachievable. I just kind of tucked in my back pocket.
SPEAKER_02:The economics of it are hard because all of everything it's it's not in America, let's put it that way. Hopefully soon it will be. Um, but you have to travel internationally for pretty much every race. Um, if you were to do something like the Skyrunner World Series, it's a lot of them are hard to get to. It's not an easy thing. So I'm just curious because I find it really interesting. I find it really cool that like that didn't deter you. You're like, I'm I'm still gonna do this. I'm gonna and we'll talk about your season this year and some of the races that you did. Um, but was that a deterrent at all? Or because it seems like a lot of American trail runners, seems like I mean, it's not even seems like it's definitely the golden trail series seems to steal all the American talent. And rightfully so, I get it. I mean, obviously they have great marketing, they have uh rate more races in the states, uh, usually one to two a year every year. Um what was it about uh for you that you're like this is not gonna be a barrier for me? I'm gonna go pursue this.
SPEAKER_00:That's a good question. I think, gosh, I mean, I mean, I'll be the first to recognize like it is a huge privilege to be able to travel and compete for anything. So that said, um there's a lot of barriers in place, and a big one is financial, um, another one is time. There's a number of other, you know, things that make it difficult. But for me, um, I guess I just didn't really take no for an answer. I didn't know when it was gonna happen. And I early on I bought um Emily Forsberg's Sky Running book, like before I even knew exactly what Skyrunning was. And I just kept it on my bookshelf and I just kept looking back at it every now and then. And, you know, like one day I don't know how, I don't know when. I didn't even know, I guess at the time if it was going to be me that was going to be able to tackle these goals, or if, you know, maybe some way, shape, or form I could inspire future generations to do that, to figure out how to do that. But um I I guess I like I grew up not really taking no for an answer with a lot of different things. And so that determination came into play. That's one side of it. There's there are a number of other things, but I'll just name two of them in particular. Um, my husband is so supportive of me, and he comes from a travel family. So his dad is a pilot or was a pilot, and his mom is a flight attendant. So um he is just pretty well versed in travel, the nuances there. So that's incredibly helpful um for me. And uh my coach is the other person who kind of came into my life very unexpectedly and has led to, I mean, I really wouldn't be able to do what I do without like either of them.
SPEAKER_02:I I read that you had actually met your coach in South Africa at a Hokush uh uh Hokushoe. Is that yeah? Is that talk about that and how that kind of evolved into because I I feel like for skyrunning, it's such a particular thing. Obviously, fitness is fitness, but there's a lot of specificity, especially when you're getting ready for certain races that you need to do. So it's it's almost its own different thing. So maybe talk about one, your preparation for races like this with your coach, and also two, how that relationship evolved.
SPEAKER_00:Yeah. So I was in, let's see, it was early 2024. I was in South Africa for a Hoka shoot, and um, it was a huge, you know, one of those like big, big production shoots where there were tons of people and big budget. And they had hired Christian, Christian Grayling, my coach, to be on set as a movement coordinator. Basically, they needed someone to help the athletes, you know, perform the right movements for the right shots kind of thing. Um sometimes that's necessary, and other times, I mean it becomes necessary when there's budget for it. But so Christian was on set and we spent a lot of time together during that shoot. Um, and we just got to talking, you know, about his background, my background, what my goals are. Um, and it came, he's a professional runner himself and has won and raced a lot of ultras and sky races. Um, him and his wife have a coaching business and they're both professional athletes and really strong at what they do. And um, I don't know, we just like hit it off pretty quickly. And I shared just some some like lock and goals with him, and he he started looking more closely at how I was running and noticed my technical skills on that type of terrain and brought up, you know, like, have you ever considered racing sky races? And it was kind of out of the blue. And I was like, now that you mention it, I have, but I have not done it yet simply because I didn't even know where to start. It's it's you know, you can look at the European field and the female athletes over there competing, and it's easy to, you know, dream, I think, but not really seeing many women in the US going after it. I didn't know where to start. So he was the one who brought it up. And Tyler, uh, my husband was the one who was like, you should, you should like, he was like nudging me. You should, you should see where that where that can go. So it took a couple other people, like believing in me, to really um go out out on that limb. And eventually, I mean, it it was not that difficult, I guess, at the end of the day for me to just see like the opportunities here wide open in front of me. I just have to take it. So um from there on forward, I was like 150% in. And I think that was the is the only way that I've been able to, I guess I'll call it like catching up, sort of to where I need to be from a fitness perspective, um, and just like general learning perspective of the whole sky running scene. And then on top of that, of course, the trail scene, because there's a lot going on, and I've learned you you need to be like acutely aware, especially if you're you know not on a team, um, to know what to do and when to do and how to do it.
SPEAKER_02:So yeah, interesting. Yeah, interesting. Um, there's a lot to unpack there. One thing I I might want to do is shift gears a little bit. I didn't want to go too much back in time, but I think it's so integral and really important for your story and for the listeners to understand like who you are as the creative as well as who you are as the athlete. Because I feel like you as the creative plays a huge role as uh in tandem with you as the athlete. Um, maybe talk about what you do professionally as well, kind of the studio you run. Um just because I don't know. One of the things that that really struck me about you and why I think you'll go really far in this sport, um, in addition to athletics, you're a very good storyteller. You're very good at being able to, your stuff is aesthetically pleasing when it comes to your social media, your website, things like that. You can convey your story very well. Um so yeah, maybe go back in time, talk about uh what you do as far as running a creative studio.
SPEAKER_00:Yeah. Um so it's like a whole other I sometimes I feel like I live two separate lives. But at the end of the day, they're very connected. So um it's it's interesting because I get asked a lot like how I do what I do, because I think some people only see the athletic side and then some people only see the creative side. But at the end of the day, yeah, they're they're hyper connected. So my husband and I own Ampersand Studios, which is a creative strategy agency. Um we do films, um, all sorts of creative assets, marketing campaigns, um, brand strategies, brand rebuilds, stuff like that. And lately we're focused mostly on like narrative storytelling. Cause at the end of the day, that's what we're both super passionate about is honestly telling other people's stories who wouldn't otherwise be told. So amplifying that. Um, but I got into it again, non-conventionally. Uh I started out like I have an undergraduate degree in neuroscience and kinesiology, so not necessarily related to running a creative studio, but from there I realized I didn't want to be, you know, in a clinic or a lab all the time. Um, and so I pivoted and actually went and got um my master's in sports product management from the University of Oregon in Portland. And so that led me to a career in the outdoor industry. Um and the entire time, so I I've I've bounced around like I've worked for some some known outdoor brands. Um, but the entire time I knew that at some point in time I wanted to open my M studio because I wanted to work for myself and I wanted to have that creative freedom. And so post-pandemic, um, I was working for an agency and got laid off because of the economy at the time. And my husband and I were like, okay, now's now's the time as ever. Kind of similar situation to just saying yes and jumping into sky running. Um, we don't know how this is gonna go, but let's let's try it. And so between the two of us, we have built up like enough, you know, our networks are pretty big in that space. And so we jumped into our creative studio not knowing what the heck we were doing, and it sort of took off, which has been amazing, a roller coaster and honestly very, very difficult but doable in also being a full-time athlete. Um the like there are some days, you know, we all know life is very glamorized on social media. And yes, I can tell a good story and you know make things look pretty online and whatnot, but they're doing both is an absolute grind, and it's also amazing. So there's a lot of risk reward, um a lot of challenges and growth that being a creative and like a business owner has provided. Um, I mean, there are days where we're like we were when I'm just thinking back to last June, when we were in Austria for um one of my races, like leading days leading up to the race, things went wrong with the client. And I was on calls like, you know, during the time of the pre-race routine where pretty much all the other athletes were getting in the right headspace, you know, stretching, form rolling, doing the things they needed to do for their body. And I was managing this other thing. So the balance there is tricky.
unknown:Yeah.
SPEAKER_02:No, I appreciate you painting that picture. And the reason I I sorry, the reason I wanted to bring it in is just because, like, as we continue to tell your story, I think and when the audience gets to see your Instagram and or sees you know your website, it makes a lot of sense. Like your ability to continue to, you know, storytelling, painting this, painting these pictures. Um, I don't know. Like I said, it makes a lot of sense when it comes into uh storytelling aspect. So I appreciate that. Um how do you like running a business with the athlete aspect, like trying to balance both? Like I I've always, especially as a podcast host, like the eventual goal of this, hopefully in the the near future, is to be my own boss and not have to live that corporate America life. Like, how do you how do you enjoy that while also training at a high level?
SPEAKER_00:Um it's hard. I mean, I'm not gonna lie, it's hard, but I um the risk, the reward is big. And it it also, I mean, we live in a world in which you're kind of as an athlete, and I've heard you talk about this, you know, on your podcast here with other um other folks, but being an athlete requires pumping out content. And so being able to um do that, I guess, with the tools that we have is is helpful. Um but sometimes there's no time for it because we're so busy doing that for other other clients. Um but I think it's like I said, the rewards are big, but the key component to all of it is discipline and like balancing my time, which that's been the case. I think I'm honestly, I think I'm the best version of myself for pretty much all things, but definitely being an athlete when I have um another outlet outside of being an athlete that gives me another place to focus my energy on or gives me a reason to not do too much, like volume-wise for training. Um so yeah.
SPEAKER_02:See, I I think you nailed something very important there. It's the I think it's the the the training aspect, but if a race goes wrong or something performance-wise isn't that isn't where you want it to be, you also have this other thing that constantly is sitting in the back of your mind that you're pursuing at a at a level of excellence as well in your business. So whereas like it's almost different, whereas like if you're working like a normal job, it's just it's it's not the same. When it's your own baby and it's your own thing, like there's a different level of of, I feel like for me at least, enthusiasm um just kind of draws a dichotomy. And it's fun to be working on multiple things and not just drawing um maybe a sense of worth from just uh athletics, you know?
SPEAKER_00:Yeah. It's complicated because it's it's easy to get like it's messy, I guess is my point. Um because so many of us who are in this sport and world, like we are, it's easy to be a perfectionist, I guess, or like type A personality, which I definitely definitely have traits of that. But I think I think if anything, owning owning my own business and doing this at the same time has taught me you can really only have success if you let go of that vision of perfection, whatever that picture looks like for you, partially, but way easier said than done.
SPEAKER_02:That's true. You have like a I and I gotta ask you this on top of that. Like you have a relatively like sizable following on social media. Like, does that do you do you pay attention to to that, or is it more for you like more focused on athletics? Like, how do you balance both of those? Like, are you concerned about metrics and because I know you've done you do brand stuff as well, trying to balance those things? Like, I I have this weird thing where I kind of hate Instagram, where like sometimes I'll be too, especially for the podcast, like I'll get too in the weeds of worrying about like, oh, this post isn't doing well, or this isn't getting as much reach as it should, or I should just be worrying about my art, right? Which is the conversation I'm having with you right now. Um or or my own athletics, which that's a different conversation. Um yeah, what what how do you like reconcile that part?
SPEAKER_00:Yeah. Um yeah, it's I mean, I also hate Instagram sometimes. I think we all kind of do. Like it's it's turned into this um this necessary, really wonderful community connection touch point, in addition to a place to be creative and an outlet, but also kind of a mandatory like requirement if you're gonna um be an athlete these days. I mean, people will disagree with me on that, and I will probably disagree with myself sometimes too on that. But I for me personally, I've always turned to it as a as an outlet. And I we all get stuck in like, oh, you know, follow or count and wanting to wanting to grow and wanting to um have influence or come across a certain way or whatever. Um so like if you go deep in my in my feed, you'll find probably like different versions of me from back then, because we all change too. I mean, I don't know. I think at the end of the day, it's an outlet for me, and it's also a means to like process things I'm going through that other people are probably going through too, or things people are curious about that I'm haven't quite nailed, but I'm like working on sort of. Um so yeah, I'm just keeping it in mind and it's fun for me. I guess the minute, the minute it feels like a drag or it's not fun, I kind of go distant from it for a little bit, but I'm kind of keeping myself in check on that.
SPEAKER_02:Interesting. Yeah, no, I I and I appreciate the candid answer because I feel like it's something we all as athletes all deal with. I mean, I'm one of those people that like I I I've I don't know, on the podcast I've been like very outspoken one way or another. And I very much believe in never being married to an idea. I used to like hate it, and then you realize the more I pay attention to alternative, I shouldn't say alternative, but like other sports. Climbing's a great example. Most climbers have like crazy social media followings. And yeah, if you want to be a really well-known climber, yeah, you have to be popular. And uh I I wonder if like that is part of the direction with our sport as well, where performance is obviously one of the most important factors, if not the most. But also if you want to convey your story and get who you are out into the world, I think social media is just a massive component of that and like a unnecessary evil, if you will. So it's it's it's this weird um tightrope. I don't know.
SPEAKER_00:I think that's yeah, it's a tightrope. Yeah, that's a good way to put it. Um so I'm yeah, I mean, I think too, we're all it's it's easy to fall into the comparison game on social media for a variety of things. And so I think um just keeping that in mind as athletes is important because there's people out there that are like way faster than me that aren't. active on social media and then there's people that are like I'm faster than that are way more active on social media. I mean I don't know it's just it's its own beast and we're all kind of trying to I'm aware that we're all trying to figure it out. No one has fully mastered it.
SPEAKER_02:That's true. That's true. All right. Now now we gotta we're going back to skyroding. I I gotta I gotta get us back into that. Um okay so this past summer you traveled a bunch uh obviously to Ireland you just for just recently you know relatively recently I can't believe we're already in December now but um relatively recently raced at Mourne Skyline as well as your Austrian race can you pronounce the the Hotch oh yeah I mean don't take this word for word but Hotchkonig okay all right that's better than I would have done okay okay yeah that's what I heard when I was there from other people now the beautiful thing about skyrunning is there's a dense calendar there's there's races literally like the season is so uh like massive if you will um what made you I know you had like a wider season as well I know obviously um what was it Minotaur was canceled and there was a few on your calendar that you didn't get to um but what made you select this current like this roster of races that you did the specific uh skyrunning ones um I was a little naive if I'm being completely honest I would do it um somewhat differently next year and plan to but also sort of similar so I think skyrunning is such a interesting like every course is so different you're at the mercy of so many different things and you don't have control of so many different things.
SPEAKER_00:So I chose the races I chose last year um based on the competitive pool that I knew or suspected would be racing there. Um places I selfishly wanted to visit and experience um because that's another part of skyrunning is it's so immersed in the the you learn so much about the culture there um when you go to these races. And um on top of that I travel like where you know these some some places are extremely hard to get to some are easier to get to though still not very easy to get to from here in the US um and then also my strengths as a runner which um I learned a lot this this season about about that and how important it is to you have your like your push races that you're probably gonna um like you have a you have a good chance of doing pretty good in it but you're you know there's the those push races are the ones that will challenge me more so than others they'll all challenge me but um than the races that I'm more set up for success with my specific success skill set. So for me I know that like literally running from sea to sky is something that I'm strong at when I start at sea level obviously I don't have to deal with altitude um I train pretty consistently at like 4,000 to 7,000 feet. So when I run at sea level I feel amazing like I can push my heart rate much harder and focus on the technicality of the course, which is where I strive I mean thrive. So that comes into play when selecting races but last year when I was looking at Austria I had never been to Austria and I just dreamt about those mountains and wanted to see what they were like firsthand. That course in particular has had I think one maybe more cancellations in the past so I knew that weather might be an issue and up until the day of the race they were projected to have like crazy lightning and maybe snowstorms that had get gotten canceled the previous year. So oddly enough that intrigued me because I know that weather weather is something that I can handle. Like we talked about earlier heat is not necessarily my best friend. So if it's colder I know that's something that I can do like perform well in um and I also wanted to my coach my coach likes to remind me to think about what I want to enjoy as a celebration drink and meal afterwards. So that came into play too with strudel and beer. I like that um but outside of that I mean Canada that's when you look at where these sky races are happening Canada's practically our backyard in comparison to some of these other distant places. So that was an easy selection plus running in those mountains is dreamy. So unfortunately that got canceled the day before because of a snowstorm um so that was a huge bummer there were athletes that had traveled from all over the world to be there and so I, you know, unfortunate um my best friend and training partner was literally boarding the plane because he was going to go race.
SPEAKER_02:Oh my gosh. He was like getting on the plane when he got the email he goes well did he leave?
SPEAKER_00:Did he get off the plane around no he got to get off the plane yeah it does. I mean we're at the mercy of like weather when you're running up high like that in pretty like high consequence terrain. So that was a huge takeaway for me this season because the next race after that that I had planned was um Beast of Big Creek which is one of was one of two only sky races in the US and so that was truly in my backyard in Washington on the the Olympic peninsula and that one got canceled because of forest fires that were raging for months unfortunately um so I don't know the status of that next year yet and then um I had planned to go to Switzerland for the Matterhorn and that one I just simply couldn't pull off due to logistics and financials. And then Ireland Ireland came around so Lauren Skyline was a dream like literally my dream course when it comes to sea to sky um that when you if you talk to other athletes like after they ran that course too like it was a fan favorite really well um well marked strong course super fun it was the equivalent of a roller coaster um I mean I think we went up and over seven different peaks during the course um like up and then you would you would uh crest the peak and you could see for the next three miles the the terrain that you're about to like roll right down and right back up. So it's pretty crazy um and super technical course. So yeah I um I'm really excited for next season I learned a lot this past season and uh I'm really grateful for you know all of like the support and just takeaways truly I feel like you cannot begin to understand skyrunning unless you go try it. And then you're like oh okay and I now I kind of understand and can comprehend what this is about and what's important and how it actually is pretty different than trail running races.
SPEAKER_02:How how has it changed obviously you've been working with your coach for a bit now and you're preparing and getting ready for this this was your first season of really doing like big world class races. How has it changed your perspective on training now as far as like the way you probably immensely right it's like night and day.
SPEAKER_00:It's um yeah I uh I mean we've been going into last season I was really focused on just like building my base and increasing aerobic capacity and focusing on some speed toward the end of my off season going into last season and I it took a lot of trust to trust him trust my training because this is going to sound crazy like my first race of the sky running season was the Austria race and I think that was um like 8,000 feet of climbing over 30k and I hadn't done a lot of vert training up until that point ton of strength ton of like flatland training and speed training and I was like Christian are you sure I'm are you sure I'm ready for this and and he he was like yeah yeah you're for where you are now and what your goals are um trust your training. And so I trusted my training and it was the hardest part of that race was not the uphill the hardest part was the last um like 10 or sorry last last five miles, eight miles maybe which ironically was most similar to probably what you'd find in like a golden trail race. It was just like undulating downhill, uphill not technical um so I've learned the training really is so specific for this type of running and racing. And I felt it again when I was in Ireland there were like five different occasions during that race where I was like oh I wouldn't be able to go be going at this pace or climbing this efficiently had it not been for that particular training run where I did like a certain set of intervals. A lot of my training is very heart rate based. So it's a constant balance of just being able to be super mindful of that like at all times during the race.
SPEAKER_02:Very cool. Yeah yeah I see like I've seen a couple photos. I haven't I tried to lurk you on Strava but you're private. I'll have to lurk it later um I've I've seen you on the track a little bit too um do you do like uh how how have the blocks worked especially now coming off the season are you back into a base period like what are you working on now yeah right now I'm in a base period I'm working on more or less like increasing volume but keeping intensity pretty low.
SPEAKER_00:So um mostly I'm staying in like zone two, zone three with most of my training runs. We're trying to I mean scientifically speaking we're trying to um you know just increase the load and volume and efficiency cardiovascular and cardiovascularly and muscular endurance wise so that I can become more efficient. I almost said comfortable but you're never comfortable running one of those races um for longer periods of time over greater distances. I right now like I'm you know I'm running like 50 mile weeks probably which feels like very very comfortable on my body and so over the next like remaining weeks in this block I'll be increasing distance as the week goes on not necessarily paying so much attention to vert you know like there's snow in the mountains and and I'll get in there soon once it fills in more but um just putting in putting in the miles. So it's a little bit mind numbing at the moment for me if I'm being honest but I try to I actually love I love running at the track because it's it's a fun opportunity for me to like test myself and and it's a really efficient workout. But I'm trying to just enjoy the the the volume right now and just like pick my head up and look around more and enjoy just the long longer runs and um I it's easy for me to get a little bit bored when I'm not running on super technical stuff. So it's yeah winter training off season training is a challenge for us all.
SPEAKER_02:Dude I feel your pain I'm gonna text my coach I had a coaching call on Friday and I was like dude could you just let me run up a mountain please at like zero please like please just please let me do something. This me nuts yeah so I totally understand um all right so back to sky running I think there's a there's a lot of questions I can pull from this I think the first one and probably the most important one is like just the their lack of representation one from the Americans over there and two just from just like American women that just we don't have a lot of them if any of them this was something we really wanted to get into and talk about going into this conversation. So I'm gonna give you the floor to talk about it and just so we can hopefully you know raise the banner and get some some more people you know from states in these races.
SPEAKER_00:I know the ladies it's it's interesting I mean there's there's work definitely being done to increase representation um for sure in trail running um and as you get more niche into the different types of trail running there's there's there's a lot of work to be done right like it's um overwhelming to to see all of the work that needs to be done. Yet at the same time the women that I have like I am so inspired by the women that have done this if you know even if they are not in the the states they're over in Europe and um those are like the role models that I have to look at at the moment. There that being said there are some other like I am not the only one in the states pursuing skyrunning. There are some really talented women out there too. But the the need to increase like the number the sheer number of women starting at you know towing the line at some of these sky races is is huge. I think I got used to like prior to starting racing skyrunning I got pretty used to just selecting the more technical courses that I could find in races that are more local and so yeah I got used to just there being fewer women in that starting mix and I thought surely going to Europe excuse me like the birthplace of skyrunning and racing in Austria there'd be hundreds of women there. And that wasn't the case. So my eyes were opened there and that made me realize like it's not it's it's not just a US problem. It's it's a global problem. And so I think there's there's a lot of work that can be done from these race organizations. There's a lot of work that can be done from like us as athletes men and women um but also brands there's a like literally golden ticket wide open opportunity or opportunities in the US for brands to step up and and be in this space more specifically for skyrunning and I I've heard rumor that's that has happened that's starting to happen um because they're the ones that have you know a lot of influence too in addition to athletes out there. So I'm excited to see some of that happen more so in the future. You know I think it comes down to it's if if we don't see other women out there doing the hard technical thing, then it's hard to picture ourselves out there in the first place. Also it's hard to know and I've asked a ton of people this question just to gather like insight um what's preventing them from getting more into sky running women in particular and the answers are financial um it's hard to travel to races that are overseas um gear no people don't know you know what they should wear or how to dress how to layer for um a sky race or just running for fun in like a sky race type of terrain and then just general awareness I mean awareness and education but how to go out and like find a place to do skyrunning in the States is a little bit confusing.
SPEAKER_02:There's also there are some barriers in place like the US is just we operate differently obvious obviously than you know some of these other places and running off trail is seen as taboo whereas in Europe it's like you'll see people just frolicking you know the the goal is how to get from the town to the top of the mountain in the most efficient line as possible and you can go off trail and go anywhere you want here that's just like pretty frowned upon um so there's yeah about that yeah yeah okay so a couple questions I have off this I think one that immediately sparks my attention I just find it interesting is and for men this is goes for men and women especially on state side but just in general it seems like golden trail man just seems to snap up a lot of a at least on the American side I can speak for it the the the elite women seem to be funneled more on the short trail side really into the golden trail and there's significantly less if any like I could think on the top of my head like maybe Kelly Wolf, Karina Anderson Michelle Morales like there's not many women that have competed over the last like but I guess Billy Kalza because I know she did Skyrace Day Mouth Dun a couple years ago but like very few. Is it the story that's being told is it the the prize money the availability of spots like I just find it very interesting on the American side how little um I mean and men too I mean I mean yeah there's really not a lot of dudes I mean what are we uh Morgan Elliott and like two other people maybe yeah Benjamin Townsend you know there's not many yeah I um well to be fair I so the Skyrunner World Series is they have an elite athlete um program where they sponsor um some athletes from around the world I don't know what their strategy is for like how they pluck or select you know people from different countries um but that that was one of the ways that I was able to they sponsored me last season so they did help with a lot of my travel and and whatnot and I do know they are going to be doing that next year but it might be it might look a little bit different.
SPEAKER_00:I don't know how yet but I think in general I mean golden is so spot on with their marketing and their content and they're just like a really well oiled machine and you put that next to UTMB and all of a sudden Skyrunning they while they while Skyrunning has been around for a long time I mean they've they've got work to do to bump pump bump up their you know like visibility and marketing and content and they know that. And they also know that there's a golden opportunity in the US so I've been asked this before like why are they not why why is there that like seem that miss I guess um and I don't really know I I haven't really figured it out. I think that what I've narrowed it down to is um a lack of education a lack of true honestly clarity on what skyrunning is and how it where it fits into trail running and ultra and mountain running and like in the states you have people trying to make these decisions between if they're running you know like UTMB races, Cirque, Golden Trail factored in a lot of you know all the others too and skyrunning there's you go to the International Skyrunning Federation website and select US and like last year there were two races. So it's just it's not big here. It's not known um yet but there's there's a lot of opportunity for it to be but there's a lot of um criteria that need to be met from the ISF to get there. And so I think that is some hurdles whereas if you you know have a race that can be called a trail race because it's on trail that's a lot easier to market, get permitting for and um put out there into the world than a race that requires like so many more levels of permitting and approval. I mean the ISF has a laundry list of things that they require um a race to have in order for it to be marked as a true sky race. So I think if you go out there and ask athletes do you want to race a sky race you'll probably get a lot of like yeah I do where do I go? How do I start? Like where do I do I have to go you know over overseas to do it. And it's kind of like well at the moment yeah but I will say I think you know Cirque series and what Julian's building there is probably the best training ground for sky racing in the US that I I've I've seen I mean that speed go obviously but I mean and of course there's broken arrow but I I don't know I have my my um particularities around a lot of other some of those races out there.
SPEAKER_02:I think the rut the rut also I broke see the rut is more a sky race to me and this is no like I love Brandon. I love Broken Arrow and I'll be at Broken Arrow this year for commentary and I but to me I think that I don't I it's hard for me to say it's a sky running course. Like sure there's a lot of avert yeah I don't think it's I and I think a lot of people all the elites listening to this are probably going to say the same damn thing. I don't think it's that technical there's sections like certain I don't have to go into specifics but like if you're looking at just a whole from a holistic I go back to the Cirque series because I think you're looking you're taking that aliaska course is bananas um I love that course that's a great when why when I I raised that in 2024 and the downhill section of that I was like screaming at the top of my lungs because I was so happy to have that that I mean you were like sliding down the mountain it was so technical. Oh yeah um I was like finally like this more of this I want yeah that Alaskan mountain scene some those are some interestingly cool people and like there's a like a there's a scene there which I think is kind of cool and I think it's it's very underground very slept on um but yeah I think if in in the United States in general if we were to do a sky race that's a spot that should be considered I don't know if there's like a multiple peak link up type of trail system that we could do but like that's that's the spot to do it. I think or that's one of the spots I think the problem with like the why and we'll get into this we'll talk more about like the US and stuff like that. But yeah the Cirque series to me is the I think the closest thing in general and I the atmosphere I like the atmosphere it's competitive the best of the best show up like very in very few races outside of Broken Arrow are you going to be able to race Patrick and Philamon on US soil which is crazy. Granted they're like a year removed from racing the series but there there's there's decent like competitiveness um and it's it's accommodating for everyone and I think it's a great interest point to the sport because it the distances are what 10 to 12 to 13k yeah at most it's it's uh I mean you you were at what did you think of crystal? I I was supposed to go this year and got sick and didn't want to make it out I was really bummed to it uh but I heard that was a a really good addition like just a great new course yeah I again great training course I went out and did the course the next day as well because I was like I want to go back and revisit some of those sections and um and just like spend some more time up there.
SPEAKER_00:But I yeah I I also think it was a great addition. I grew up skiing that mountain so it was really cool to like run it in a race. I'd never done a race at Crystal um but I also think I think and don't quote me on this but I think there used to be some sort of sky running race there.
SPEAKER_01:There's a marathon there.
SPEAKER_00:Yeah okay that's what I thought.
SPEAKER_02:So like also great skyrunning terrain I think obviously you're when you're stuck to the the confines of like the resort you're not getting the technicality of a lot of the other like peaks around there but like gosh open that course up make it longer and get into some of the other stuff like the backcountry stuff and you've got yourself a skyrunning race so um yeah I got so excited about that was that your did I answer your question I want to shift yours a little bit I have a question for you because we were copied on on an email with US Skyrunning what role to like is that an arm of the ISF like what what role did they did they play? Like what's the deal with that?
SPEAKER_00:Yeah um they are I again don't quote me on this but my take is they're an arm of the ISF they work with the ISF um I've met with them and um the ISF they all kind of communicate and work together and everybody is acutely aware of the opportunity in the states um so I I there's a lot more that can be done in the states with the US skyrunning organization and I'm excited to hear more about those plans and and work more closely with Ryan and um we'll see um I know that the youth skyrunning organization that they've that Ryan has built for USA is has been a major focus of theirs. So that's great. Like love to see that I know they've hosted camps for girls who are like really strong cross country runners in um high school and tried to expose them to some of the more like technical terrain which also love that that's great. They were based in Vermont and then they moved to uh Italy which because they I I think they wanted those mountains which don't blame them for that dolomites are irreplaceable but um you know that just they're they're over there and there's a lot of work to be done over here. So um I'm excited to see you know how all of that kind of plays out.
SPEAKER_02:No I I like that and the reason I asked is because like I I see you as this just a really good figure for uh maybe maybe an ambassador I think is more of the right word this ambassador for US skyrunning you go abroad and you race these races you get to experience this whole thing. And I think that there's a great opportunity there for yourself and others that that race the Skyrunner series the world series. Jackson Cole's a great example too I know he's uh you know he's uh he's a little bit quieter on the on the front but like goes and races everything is one of the best in the world um I think there's there's opportunities there for to raise awareness and get more conversation about skyrunning in the states uh just let me ask you this like I know you've had conversations you don't have to give anything away I feel like we're close to maybe having more races like I know on the website what is it the Broken Era 23k is there one certified course and then the other one's Beast of Big Creek is it are we are we close to to something else being added?
SPEAKER_00:Like is that a possibility or you know I yes and the difficulty the the challenges are still the same and I I don't think there's been anything done to like ease those challenges if that makes sense. So I agree with you like the rut I would love to see that become an official course I again excuse me the technicality side of things like they the ISF Wants to heavily protect the integrity of what it means to Skyrun and be an official skyrunning course. And I'm all for that. So I do think we're going to start to see more US-based races get that certification as that educational side grows. Also, and I should have mentioned this earlier, one of the things, one of the initiatives that USA Skyrunning and the ISF is working on is an official skyrunning coaching certification, which will be interesting to see how that affects the landscape at all. I think, you know, I'm in favor of it because I think that again, the more education we can get out there, um, the better. And I think that will also trickle into helping more courses become official skyrunning courses. But we're also we're also um affected by our permitting system here, insurance barriers like that that are just bigger levers to to pull. So we'll see. Um yeah.
SPEAKER_02:How aware are you of like the 2019 series they or like the the series that died in 2019? There was like Skyrunner USA. Yeah, which was like a thing. Yeah, it was actually it's funny. When you were talking about like the first races that you did, like when I first got into the sport, like that was like what I was looking at doing. Like there was I think it was the Sangra de Cristo 27k, which is like just two laps up and down a fire, like a steep fire road. Yeah. What are we doing? This is sky running. Um, but yeah, I I I totally understand the need to protect uh the sanctity of a like dude, the rut would be so perfect because that that course is be so perfect, so nasty. Yeah, that's uh yeah, that would work perfect. I mean, there's a lot. I mean, I don't know how like is there a certain distance length they have to have? Like, or is it um just there is there is a certain distance length.
SPEAKER_00:I don't know it off the top of my head, but it's like if you break down a course, they're particular about every single like the the percentage incline, the average incline over the course of the entire distance, the course distance, the like climbing grade. It has to have a specific climbing grade where it's you don't require you know equipment for climbing, like with specific gear, but the course can have ropes. So like sometimes you might be required to um not bring your own rope, but like use rope that's there, wear a helmet, things like that. So yeah, yeah. To answer your question, 2019, I'm like, man, I I missed, I missed that. But but I think it's probably like it will come back in a in a better, stronger way.
SPEAKER_02:I like that.
SPEAKER_00:So TVD on I'm hopeful now when that happens. Yeah, I mean, I'm hopeful too. It's and I agree with you, Alaska's like quintessential, like probably that in the Wasatch, yeah, best terrain for it.
SPEAKER_02:It's funny. I'm such a snob that like like I I I'm like very like I I get even mad at like some of the like the road builders in Colorado. I'm like, you guys couldn't build a 17.5% road like ski road, like I know environments anywhere. Like I have to like travel for this, I have to use my treadmill. Um the dude, the Wasatch is where it's at. I I have to be honest with you. I know. Like, I know people want to talk a big game about Boulder, and Boulder's cool and all, but I think the best training ground in America has got to be the Wasatch. I can't believe I'm saying that, but it's true.
SPEAKER_00:It's okay. I am so glad you said that because I have had my qualms with Boulder, I've almost moved there like five different times. My coach living in South Africa, he's like, Boulder's like the the mecca for him in the US. He's like, just move to Boulder, move to Boulder. And I agree. Like, I I I mean it's great. Don't get me wrong. I spent a lot of time there. But I when it comes to just wanting to go up and practice up and down in technical terrain, like yeah, I have to say Wasatch and Alaska are probably like the winners.
SPEAKER_02:The Northeast the Northeast is sick too. I just think that lane, I think actually very slept on, like the White Mountains in New Hampshire are everything there is built straight up and straight down. It doesn't have quite the vertical relief that I mean, some sections definitely do. Um, but like if you're trying to race, the problem with the White Mountains is it just doesn't have the altitude. Whereas like if you're trying to get ready for something of more Europe-based, I do. I really think the Wash makes or if you're trying to race in the LaSatch, like a Cirque series races or speed goat, it makes the best sense to train for something like that. Um yeah. Really quick, I want to pivot uh and talk about 2026. Like, what do you what do you uh have planned for this upcoming year for racing?
SPEAKER_00:Yeah, I am like in the thick of planning for that right now. Um and just waiting at the moment for the Skyrunner World Series schedule to be released. It should be released like any moment. So excited for that. That's what I'll kind of build my racing schedule around is those the I'll I'll pick like four to five Skyrunner World Series races to be like my A-level races, and then from there I'll filter in some B level races that are great and fun and um support the A-level races. So as far as I don't think I have a hunch, it's just a hunch, that Austria is gonna be a sky race next year. I think they've switched that around. And um otherwise, I would love to race that course again because I think I would do a lot better this this year and have a good chance of being top 10 in it. Um so we'll see on that one. I'm definitely gonna go back to Canada because have some redemption to get. And I just want to see, I mean, those mountains are insane. So uh that's on the list. And then um I would love to go back to Ireland. That race was really fun, and this this past year was special because it was the UK national skyrunning championship. So it was there are a lot of people there and strong talent, and I think that'll be the case next year too. So yeah, I am excited to see there's supposedly some, well, there's supposedly less races on the Skyrunner World Series calendar next year, and um I'm happy about that because that's gonna make the pool, the field, just deeper at the races that they do have. And then they're gonna add a couple of races too. So I'm like, yeah, we'll see. I'm excited to see to see what what they come forward with. But I would love to race the rut. Um, you know, I unfortunately broken arrow tends to be on the same weekend as a Skyrunner World Series race as Minotaur. So I I'll do Minotaur not instead of broken arrow for the same reasons that you shared earlier. Like I I it's like almost but not quite. I don't know. I would say I was really bumped.
SPEAKER_02:I wanted to go, like, I'm definitely going out to Broken Arrow this year, but I wanted to do back-to-back weekends where I race on the East Coast and then cover broken cover broken arrow and then cover minotaur and maybe race Minotaur, but also do like race coverage for it. And now that Minotaur, I think Minotaur, I'm pretty sure it's on the same weekend as Broken Arrow, so it's definitely not gonna happen. I think so. Yeah, yeah. I know this year it's a special year too, because I think it's the North American final, right? Yeah.
SPEAKER_00:It is. Um Championship or something like that. Youth.
SPEAKER_02:Yeah.
SPEAKER_00:Youth Championship.
SPEAKER_02:It's something it no, I think it's beyond that. I think it's it's like one step up to. I think it's a I don't know, they just announced something that I totally think.
SPEAKER_00:It's um, yeah, it's huge. So that'll be a competitive, fun, popular race. Uh so I'm super jazzed about that. I'm also considering going to do the Mexico Sky Challenge. It's usually in March, actually, sorry, May. Um ironically, like you'd think going to Mexico from here would be easy, but it actually like the flight time getting to the specific town that it's in is is um is rather difficult. It ends up being like the same amount of time to get to Maria Alm, which is where the Austria Sky Race is located. So we'll see. But outside of that, I'm gonna do I'm I'm probably gonna do a couple, like you know, for fun local races leading into the season. Um I try to do those and support some of the local race series, and then maybe like a road half just to for fun to kind of work on speed. Um, but we'll see. Yeah, that's exactly mostly that.
SPEAKER_02:Very cool. Yeah. We're uh actually one more thing to add to that, dude. All tracks extreme, that race looks nuts. Oh my gosh.
SPEAKER_00:Yeah, yeah. So I mean, yeah, I didn't say if if I can, I would love to do that race because I did not do that last year. And just to experience that, that course is like the real deal. Like they do not, there's no BS. They're like, you're either here and you're able to race this or you're not gonna be able to race this. Oh, too.
SPEAKER_02:Awesome. What is it? Uh Day Math uh what is it, Sky Race, Day Math Sin? That's another sick race. Yeah, I maybe I that's high on my list. Maybe next year I'll do the Skyrunner series, or at least do a couple of them, throw them in because they do some of them like math, day math sin, because that fits in that's like early season. What is that? Like May? Yeah, I think it's like late May.
SPEAKER_00:So yeah, it's early. I almost I yeah, that's a popular one too. So it's like the the field is is deep in that and it's beautiful. Oh my gosh.
SPEAKER_02:Yeah, and you can cut switchbacks, which is crazy.
SPEAKER_00:I know another thing that you definitely are not allowed to do here. They like applaud that there.
SPEAKER_02:They're like, oh big no no here. Yeah, it's funny. I um I don't know if you cross paths with Benjamin or Rio Townsend. Uh they live locally in Colorado Springs. Benjamin uh they both did the U23, and uh Benjamin was telling me when he raced Sky, I think Sky Dameuth Sin a couple of years ago was like his first Skyrunner race, and he was like astonished because like they're like calling the switchbacks and he's like didn't know what to do. He's like, Do I do this? Do I not? Yeah. So yeah, it's the yeah, you're like, What?
SPEAKER_00:Is this legal? Like, yeah. Yeah, and it turns out the only way to win the race is if you do that.
SPEAKER_02:So that's true. That's true. Yeah, he was like, dude, he's like, Antonio Martinez ran like a mile less than me and won the race. It was like, he's like, what the hell?
SPEAKER_01:Yeah, yeah, yeah.
SPEAKER_02:Um last thing I want to get to. Where are you at on sponsor search? Are you are you a free agent right now? Are you looking for for I'm a free agent?
unknown:All right.
SPEAKER_00:Yeah, I've um had so prior to I was working with Neurona, they were kind of my longer term partner for three years. They um are starting to get more into US, which is which is great, but from strictly a racing perspective, they're less focused on racing. So I decided to go out on my own um and not um continue working with them last uh spring and just wanted to um, I mean, I've worked with like you said earlier, like brands here and there on on things. And um I decided going into last season, I wanted to just kind of I was able to do it, you know, with with just being a free agent, being my being on my own, and um was able to kind of make it work with with work and working for myself and financially. And so I decided to just like do the season like that and see what could come of it and not go into it with any crazy pressure from sponsors. Um and it was great, and I'm glad I did that because I think it's a different, it's a different experience than when you're working with a brand and have to, you know, there's a lot of things that come with that. But moving forward, I mean, all the travel and everything required and um it's I I am looking and I want to do so intentionally, and I've been pretty focused on prioritize prioritizing that like level of intentionality and making sure that partnerships ideally like are long-term for me. They're not one-off and it's really like true value alignment in you know what works for me from a product perspective, but also like where we're headed. I want to work with the brands or brands that see, you know, the value and are putting their um walking the talk of trying to get more representation out there, more women involved, more women in technical terrain. So um yeah, being patient and trying to be intentional about it. But yeah, free agent at the moment.
SPEAKER_02:I like that. I like that. All right, that's a good pitch. We put that out into the world. Um I think that there's and I I don't know, I I your background too speaks so well, um, especially given what you do professionally and uh being able to marry that. I think there's a lot of good good potential and cool stuff there for the future. So very cool.
SPEAKER_00:Thanks. Yeah.
SPEAKER_02:Yeah. Do you think we I think we're at what hour 10, hour 11? I think we got everything. Is there anything you wanted to uh throw in at the end there that you don't think we covered?
SPEAKER_00:No, I think um yeah, I think we pretty much much got to everything. Um I'm excited to to see how next season shapes up. And I think there's like I've been what keeps me inspired, especially during you know, going into off-season like this, is just the questions that I've been asked of interested or from interested runners, interest interested skyrunners. And so, you know, if if anybody listening to this ever has any questions about that, like my door is always open and I'm happy to chat anytime.
SPEAKER_02:I was gonna say something similar to you. I I you're gonna be like my skyrunning person. If you if you have you ever have something you want to talk about, like skyrunning-wise or whatever, like well, your the microphone's always yours. I think that there's good really like especially as the sport develops and grows in the United States and as it starts to kind of catch legs, um, I think there's gonna be opportunities or a lot of room for conversation as uh it starts to grow. So definitely looking forward to more of those conversations down the line.
SPEAKER_00:Yeah, no, me too, for sure. And I think it will grow. I think it's only a matter of time, and I think there's enough interest now and curiosity that it's only it's only going to grow. Um, so I'm excited to revisit that conversation when the time comes.
SPEAKER_02:Sweet. Well, Robin, I really appreciate your time. Thank you so much for coming on, and uh, I'm a big fan. I appreciate it.
SPEAKER_00:Yeah, likewise. Thanks so much for having me.
SPEAKER_02:There we go. Cool, stopped. Um, thank you so much. I really appreciate it. Well, what'd you guys think? Oh man, what a fun episode! Definitely a fun conversation with Robin and really looking forward to having her back on as the uh sky running continues to evolve in the United States. Robin's definitely a thought leader and just a pioneer in that space. Um, not easy going over and doing your whole racing series abroad, and it's definitely something she's been doing. And uh yeah, just definitely want to commend her for that and uh excited to see where her career is gonna take her in the sport. Um guys, if you enjoyed this one, definitely follow Robin. You can find her at Mindfully Robin on Instagram. Give her a follow. Um, check out her website, yeah. Check out her website, it's mindfully robin as well. Both are gonna be linked in the show notes. Um if you enjoyed this episode and have been enjoying what we've been doing, give us a five-star rating and review on Apple, Spotify, YouTube, or wherever you consume your podcast. Subscribe on YouTube, and if you're listening on Apple, not just give us a five-star review, but guys, tell us why you're liking the pot. Tell me what you've been enjoying. Um, definitely appreciate that and always love the feedback so we can continue to improve this thing. Uh, very last but not least, um, guys, if you are interested in getting some apparel or any soft goods, uh hydration solution uh for your loved ones for the holidays, use code SteepstuffPod. That's one word Steep Stuff Pod uh at checkout on ultimate direction.com. All kinds of good stuff there from Ultimate Direction. Use code Steep Stuff Pod. I'm gonna get you 25% off. Uh guys, we've got some fun episodes coming down the little pipeline. Thanks for tuning in. Have a great rest of your week.
